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Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
03-03-2014, 06:00 PM
Post: #1
Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
Missile 3 does 18 damage each, plus 5% of the ships structure. Let's say 10 missiles hit the same time on the same ship, and, said ship has no armor or shields left, and, 500 structure.

So.... do all 10 missiles do 18 + (500 *.05) = 18 + 25 = 43?

Or, does the first one do 43, then the second one 18 + (457*.05) = 40.85 and so on?

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03-03-2014, 10:49 PM (This post was last modified: 03-04-2014 12:39 AM by Diebo.)
Post: #2
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
(03-03-2014 06:00 PM)sfatula Wrote:  Missile 3 does 18 damage each, plus 5% of the ships structure. Let's say 10 missiles hit the same time on the same ship, and, said ship has no armor or shields left, and, 500 structure.

So.... do all 10 missiles do 18 + (500 *.05) = 18 + 25 = 43?

Or, does the first one do 43, then the second one 18 + (457*.05) = 40.85 and so on?

It calculates each one separately. I tried 3 1xnuke3 frigates against a mammoth with bulkhead 2 (no other weapons on either). Hold position, to rule out movement differences. No shields on mammoth.

Nuke #1 did 18 damage to armor, 50 to structure.
Nuke #2 did 18 damage to armor, 48 to structure.
Nuke #3 did 18/45
Nuke #4 did 18/43
Nuke #15 did 18/24.

Nuke bonus damage is truncated (instead of rounded). In your above example, the second one does 18 + trunc(475*.05=23) = 41

Average bonus damage for 3 Nuke 3 was 36 against a 1012 structure mammoth. With the damage to armor, that averages 54.
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03-04-2014, 03:13 AM
Post: #3
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
Beginner question now! I thought armor had to go to 0 before the missiles get any structure damage? Why would you say the average is 54? You are implying it does 18 to armor AND 36 to structure?

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03-04-2014, 03:27 AM
Post: #4
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
(03-04-2014 03:13 AM)sfatula Wrote:  Beginner question now! I thought armor had to go to 0 before the missiles get any structure damage? Why would you say the average is 54? You are implying it does 18 to armor AND 36 to structure?

Nope, the bonus damage to structure applies as long as there are no shields. It gives you a way to slow enemy ships (they lose speed as they lose structure) before actually removing all fo the armor.

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03-04-2014, 03:27 AM
Post: #5
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
(03-04-2014 03:13 AM)sfatula Wrote:  Beginner question now! I thought armor had to go to 0 before the missiles get any structure damage? Why would you say the average is 54? You are implying it does 18 to armor AND 36 to structure?

Shields block bonus damage, armor does not.

That is why shields combined with ECM are so effective against nukes. Any damage that gets through the ECM hits the shields first, which both block a portion of the damage, and heal.

With ECM but no shields, any nuke that gets through would do bonus damage.

But the rub is that nukes are the longest-distance weapons, so they are the first things to hit the shields. Wouldn't it be fantastic if you could wait to fire your nukes until your lasers/plasma have stripped the shield first? Like wait until turn 20 or so to fire the nukes, or space the nukes out so that they fire once every five turns instead of every turn. Mid-combat nukes would even have a role in big battles with large ships.

As it is now, once people have shields 2+ and starbase 2 and ECM, you're usually better off switching to plasma or proton.
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03-04-2014, 05:41 AM
Post: #6
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
So, on a ship that might be 80 shields, 150 armor, 150 structure... The first 5 missiles bring the shields down (speaking of one round). The 6th missile (ignoring the small amount left from missile 5) does 18 damage to armor, and, 7 to structure, right?

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03-04-2014, 05:47 AM
Post: #7
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
(03-04-2014 05:41 AM)sfatula Wrote:  So, on a ship that might be 80 shields, 150 armor, 150 structure... The first 5 missiles bring the shields down (speaking of one round). The 6th missile (ignoring the small amount left from missile 5) does 18 damage to armor, and, 7 to structure, right?

Yup. Shields do block some damage, and do heal, so it might take more than 5 to punch through the armor, but once it does punch through, your calculation is correct. =trunc(150*0.05) = 7 to structure, plus 18 to armor.
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03-04-2014, 07:10 AM
Post: #8
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
I was speaking of one combat round, i do not believe shields heal within a round, right? Is there a formula somewhere for how quickly shields heal per combat round or however it works? Exclusive of improved energy controller.

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03-04-2014, 07:38 AM
Post: #9
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
(03-04-2014 07:10 AM)sfatula Wrote:  I was speaking of one combat round, i do not believe shields heal within a round, right? Is there a formula somewhere for how quickly shields heal per combat round or however it works? Exclusive of improved energy controller.

Since v1.2.1, "- Tweak: All base shield points are now double what they were. Shield base damage blocking changed to 2/4/6/8 (was 1/2/3/4)." (from the Whipping Post).

So shield 2 would block 4 points per attack. To take down 80 pts of shield in a round, you would need 6 nukes (?). The first five nukes do 18-4 pts each, or 14 each for 70 damage. The sixth nuke does 14 damage and punches through.

Rocco - correct me if I am wrong and the shield block is by overall ship attack. If so, then 5 nukes from a single ship (say a cruiser) would do 90 damage all at once (5 x 18), minus 4 blocked damage, and punch through the shields.
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03-04-2014, 07:51 AM
Post: #10
RE: Missile 3 bonus damage - how!
(03-04-2014 07:38 AM)Diebo Wrote:  Rocco - correct me if I am wrong and the shield block is by overall ship attack. If so, then 5 nukes from a single ship (say a cruiser) would do 90 damage all at once (5 x 18), minus 4 blocked damage, and punch through the shields.

It used to be as you describe, but at some version in the past (my memory is spotty as to which specific version) we switched from a flat damage reduction to a percentage blocking. So now a "4" blocking would equate to a 4% damage reduction.

Shield damage reduction applies to each weapon's individual damage, and is applied so long as there are any shield points left at the time the weapon hits.
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